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Thread: 2012 Presidential Election Thread

  1. #151
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    Nah, this will be a current event topic through election day.
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  2. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillC View Post
    Nah, this will be a current event topic through election day.
    I wish people next time would just make a new thread so I don't have to see it in my email and I can still lazily avoid having to figure out how to stop watching a thread.
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  3. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciliatus View Post
    Interesting discussion here. Being from Europe, I dont really have a deep understanding how US politics work. I often wonder how Americans can be satisfied with only 2 parties. We have 5 parties in the government here, and i still dont feel its enough. So i really cant understand the point that was made, that more parties would lead only to more unhappy people, because they didnt vote for this or that president.

    Also no one here can understand how anybody could be against public health service. Nobody would want to miss it here. Nobody has to wait months for health care. In fact you can walk in any hospital any time of the day and get treated. And if you have any serious conditions and need surgical treatment also that is done in a matter of minutes or days depending how serious your status is.
    Think about it. What should the country rather spend money and tax dollars on, than into this very basic human need? The need to be treated when sick. Me and my wife are both full time employed. To the point we often dont see each other and are for sure net. payers to the system. But i wouldnt want anybody die or go bankrupt because he cant afford the treatment.
    Imagine you getting a really serious health condition in the future. You would want to get treated also without getting bankrupt. And if i understand half about how American insurance companies work and how they can turn you down with shady formal errors id rather like to trust government non profit organizations than companies that look first and foremost on their profit.

    About Obama. I dont know much about the bills he passed i only read a lot about his fews. And he seems to be a reasonable man to me, but bound through lot of politics.
    Anyways whoever thinks that he ruined the USA must have missed a little thing called world wide economic crisis. Mainly inflicted by conscienceless business men at the stock market. A part of the economics that government should take more control of imho.

    It was also mentioned that Buffet can write a check to the government at any time. But thats not the point. He sure could, but he wants that everybody of the top income people pays their fraction. Its about time that the richest of the rich pay their part. And even more the multi million dollar companies that only try to maximize their profit each year, paying less and less to their employees and more and more to their managers.
    Its about time government makes politics for the people and not for companies that they hope to get leading, good payed jobs in, after their political career.

    I am not all as liberal as it might seem. I say punish those that abuse welfare system, kick them out. I also dont have very warm feelings about many immigrants here in Austria, because too many of them come to abuse our welfare system, never contribute to it or are even part of criminal organizations. But on the other side i have absolutely no problem with immigrants that get here, work as hard as anyone else and adapt to our country. They are more than welcome. That being said immigration laws are much stricter in the US than here in Austria. We take almost anybody who wants to immigrate. They can even get caught at criminal actions during their immigration process and wont get sent away.

    Just one more thing that many republicans might hate me for. But i dont understand how anybody could vote for someone like Palin or Bachmann. I mean who would like someone at the steering wheel that is dumb as bread? There have to be more suitable republican candidates for that job than those 2.

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  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by Autumnrose View Post
    Not to be snarky, but I don't understand how people from other countries can really grasp and comment that much on our politics when they don't live here.
    I was thinking it was nice to hear an opinion from someone from someplace else. He has experienced things that we haven't and can comment on how those things work out in practice.
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  6. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren and Hunter View Post
    I was thinking it was nice to hear an opinion from someone from someplace else. He has experienced things that we haven't and can comment on how those things work out in practice.
    Most people don't realize that non-Americans actually get decent amounts of news from other places and a decent education on those places in school. Third world countries nonwithstand.

    Anything about this election can be summed up simply as "We're screwed no matter what happens".

  7. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by saisaac View Post
    There are too many obvious contradictions for me to even consider voting for any of the Republicans.
    What about liberal contradictions, such as wanting equal rights for all but supporting affirmative action? Wanting to base policy on science but then dismissing science that goes against the agenda? Free speech but wanting to shut out that which disagrees with them? For an increasingly progressive tax system but want to spend the middle class' money to build stadiums for billionaire owners and millionaire players? I could go on and on. Both sides have their own hypocritical stances; surely you can't believe that only conservatives do?

    If you are for small government/ less government interference in our day to day lives than you cannot be for an ever expanding military industrial complex and you cannot restrict the rights of homosexuals or other groups based on your religious beliefs. Those ideas simply are not compatable. Outlawing gay marriage is a blatant intrusion on individual rights.
    The military doesn't put regulations and restrictions on our lives the way that other Federal government departments do. Conservatives don't stand for an ever expanding "military industrial complex," nor do they even believe that it exists - leave that to conspiracy theorists. Many Republicans want to trim all areas of the Federal government, including the military, because it could also be run more efficiently, and should.

    Conservatives don't stand for restricting the rights of any individuals by the way, including gay Americans. Marriage isn't a right, for straights or gays. The Constitution defines what the Federal government may do, and believe that it has no right sticking its nose into the issue. It should be for the states to decide, if anyone. Sure, some people oppose it on a religious basis, but no laws are passed, or attempting to be passed using religion as an argument.

    I was all for Ron Paul in theory until I found out some of his views on gay marriage and other social issues. I would have thought that a libertarian would by default be for allowing equal rights and less government intrusion for all people.
    I think you need to understand what Libertarians stand for. It's all about the Constitution. States' rights, a limited Federal government, and individual rights enumerated to us by different levels of government. Things like abortion, gay rights, etc should not be allowed or disallowed by the Federal government, but left to individual states. You might be thinking of "human rights," which are not anything of legal consequence or defined by our country. They are something dreamt up by leftists who wish to see their own version of utopia imposed upon all people.
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